The Physics of Time
Even before Einstein, physics was
never really supportive of our common-sense ideas about time. Humankind has
long believed that the past and the future are very different, the one over,
done with, fixed, the other ahead, open, malleable. The past keeps gaining new
territory from the future across the boundary of the present. The calendar date
of tomorrow becomes that of today, then of yesterday. All this seems to force upon
us the conclusion that now is something that moves.
Science, with physics at its base, has
been a great success in explaining the phenomena of our world: thunder, billiards,
fire, elevators, airplanes, the ability of fish to swim and viruses to infect. What
did Newtonian physics have to tell us about this moving now? Nothing. The
equations of physics contain variables for time, t1, t2, even
t0, but no “now.”
With Einstein, physics stopped
being unhelpful regarding our shared sense that the now moves, and became hostile,
or at least unfriendly.
According to special relativity, for
those in one speeding railroad car event A precedes event B,
while for the passengers in the oncoming train on the other track B precedes
A. (Trains were Einstein’s
vehicles for his thought experiments, but at train speeds, especially US train
speeds, A and B would have to be very, very close in time from
the perspective of both trains to get the temporal order disparity. We can make
that shift quantitatively more dramatic by substituting, for the trains, spaceships
heading towards each other at a respectable percentage of the speed of light.
If they are far apart, all the better.)
Another way to put the key point is
that one train’s now traveled through event A before it got to B
and the now of the other train was at B before moving on to A.
Which train’s now is the real one? You already know the answer: each is correct
in its own framework and neither framework, neither now, is privileged. So says
special relativity.
There are frameworks at a great
distance from us and moving away in which Caesar’s Crossing the Rubicon is now
(that is, in its simultaneity hyperplane), and distant frameworks moving
towards us in which New Year’s 3000 is now.
Relativity has no unique now
sweeping across the events of history. If there is any moving now at all, then
there must be a vast number of them, and we jump from one to another when ever
we start or stop moving, speed up or slow down, turn or spin. They cannot be
called upon to divide an objective universal past from an objective universal
future.
So, no now is privileged in the
grand sense, and it seems to follow that every event in the entire history of
the universe, from the Big Bang onward forever, has as much claim to be now as
every other event. It may make this a little less counterintuitive to reflect
that whenever you have thought “this is now,” you have been right. So perhaps
it is intrinsic to every event, wherever located in space and time, that it is
now.
Einstein:
Since there exists in this
four dimensional structure [space-time] no longer any sections which represent
"now" objectively, the concepts of happening and becoming are indeed
not completely suspended, but yet complicated. It appears therefore more
natural to think of physical reality as a four dimensional existence, instead
of, as hitherto, the evolution of a three dimensional existence. [Relativity
(1920), Appendix 5, 120.]
“Past, present, and future are all
equally real. They all exist.” (Brian Greene, Video “The Fabric of the Cosmos:
The Illusion of Time” 26:55). “The past is not gone, and the future isn’t
non-existent. Past, future, and the present are all existing in exactly the
same way." Max Tegmark, MIT, Ibid. 27:20.
Emphasis added). This idea that each point of space time is, objectively, as
real, with as good a claim to being now, as every other point is often called
by the philosophers of time “block eternalism.”
It is widely believed to follow
from block eternalism that the moving now is an illusion. Einstein: “For us who
believe in physics, the separation between past, present and future has only
the significance of an illusion, albeit a tenacious one." [Letter to the
family of M.A. Besso, 1955. There are several translations of this floating
around. Here is the original: “Für uns
gläubige Physiker hat die Scheidung zwischen Vergangenheit, Gegenwart und
Zukunft nur die Bedeutung einer, wenn auch hartnäckigen, Illusion ]
Note that Einstein is not saying
that for a given event there is no difference between its future and its past.
Those are quite separate portions of 4 space. Direction in time isn’t relative.
His point is that there is no objective line that divides the past from the
future.
Greene goes into a little more
detail on the illusory nature of the moving now:
It is as though our minds
provide the projector light . . ., so that the moments of time come to life
when they are illuminated by the power of consciousness. . . Within each
individual slice, your thoughts and memories are sufficiently rich to yield a
sense that time has continuously flowed to that moment. This feeling, this
sensation that time is flowing doesn’t require previous moments – previous
frames to be “sequentially illuminated”.” (The Fabric of the Cosmos, 139-40.)
At first I read this to say that
an internal projector in our minds itself moved along illuminating on moment
after another. So, although there is no objective moving now, now really did
move – subjectively and illusorily. This would raise such embarrassing questions
as whether different people could have their internal projectors shining on
different days – so that for you the now was on Monday while my now had already
reached Thursday. If this is impossible, what is it that would keep each of our
subjective projectors together? A master projector synchronizer would seem a
lot like an objective moving now. Then again, perhaps it would make no
difference if your subjective now was on a different day from mine. Why
couldn’t I now be talking to someone for whom that conversation took place three
days ago? These perplexities led me to think I might have misinterpreted Greene.
What I believe Greene is really saying
is only that whenever we happen to think about it, we “project on” memory data
that convinces us that the now is moving. This happens every time we activate
the projector. We always summon the same illusion of passing time. No
“apprehending” time passing is any worse grounded than any other; but none is
any better.
That no event in space-time has any
better credentials than any other to claim existence or now-ness and that the moving
now is an illusion is the view of many of the physicists whose professional
specialization brings them in contact with the question and of probably a
plurality of the philosophers of time.
So let me assume that the
eternal-block-no-moving-now-every-moment-really-exists theory is right and ask
what that means for the common sense view that it is now as you read this
paragraph, that yesterday is no longer now and that tomorrow isn’t yet. How can
it be that your celebrations of last New Year’s Eve exist in every bit as real a
way and have the same claim to nowness as your reading of this sentence?
The puzzle is if last New Year’s
events and events of your reading this blog really have exactly the same
existence and now status, how it is that you are (or seem to be) reading this
only and not also celebrating New Year’s?
If no time is privileged, why is it that this time seems so definitely to be yours now – to be privileged for you?.
The Mayfly Theory of Self Identity
To try to unravel this, it is going
to be helpful to survey a little of the theory of personal identity as it turns
up in common sense and in the philosophical literature. If you already are
familiar with personal identity and related matters, you might want to skip the
next 6 paragraphs.
In ordinary life we have various
reasons for wanting to distinguish the same person over time. It is important
that the person the surgeon has on the operating table is the same person as
was diagnosed with appendicitis. It is unjust if the person sent to prison is
not the same as the person who took the money. In the latter case, however, we
would make an exception if the hands grabbing the money out of the safe
belonged to a body with electrodes in its brain through which a remote operator
controlled those hands. Then it would be this remote operator who committed the
larceny.
Novelists, and sometimes even we in
the non-fiction world, opine that someone was not really himself, or not the
same person, after her trauma or after four years at college or four years in
prison.
Extreme cases of amnesia and of
multiple personality call for nuanced judgments about personal identity properly
to describe personal relationships (whom did he love?) and fairly to distribute
praise and blame for actions. Philosophical thought experiments about brain
transplants, divided brains, duplicated brains, and memory transfers can put
our intuitions about personal identity into conflict, a conflict that is
sometimes, but not always, resolved by being more precise as to the purpose for
which we are asking “Is this the same person?”
Among the purposes for which we
might want to know whether Person B is identical to Person A is
whether A ought rationally fear pains or welcome pleasures that will
befall B in the future. For an easy example, if A is the donor in
a brain transplant and B is the donee, it is rational pre-transplant for
A but not B to fear the root canal on B’s molar scheduled
for after the operation. Philosophers argue whether the person entering a Star
Trek transporter will feel the pains of the person who steps out on the alien
planet (or whether it would simply be lights out for the person on the dematerialization
pad).
Then there are philosophers who
contend that 10-year-old-A should not fear the pains of 80-year-old-A, either
because of difference in the physical constituents of the brain, or because of
the difference in memory contents, or because of difference in values,
purposes, and projects, or because of some combination of the above. The self of the 10-year-old might, 70 years
later, feel none or only a portion of the pains of the 80-year-old, being, by
then, at most a minority shareholder.
Yet a little more philosophy may
help me set up the intuition I want to encourage before we face our problem
head on. Bertrand Russell: "There is no logical impossibility in the
hypothesis that the world sprang into being five minutes ago, exactly as it
then was, with a population that 'remembered a wholly unreal past." (The
Analysis of Mind, 159). It would, of course, require enormous intelligence,
calculational capacity, and engineering resources to accomplish this feat. It
is an extraordinarily implausible hypothesis, but that was not Russell’s
concern. His point was simply that neither our memories nor any other evidence
could strictly disconfirm the creation-plus-5-minutes hypothesis. I need only
that we could have memories that are fake in the less dramatic sense that it
was someone else who had the experiences that laid in those memories. As long
as the memory content was right, there would be no way for us to tell.
Finally, I will get to the point.
To be brief, and brutal, you exist only in this moment. It was not you who celebrated
New Year’s Eve last. That is, it was not you in the important sense of someone
for whom, with perfect physical and metaphysical knowledge, it would have been
rational to be apprehensive that she would herself suffer any pains that you
now feel. Properly informed, that self of New Year’s would have known that it
would not survive to peruse this blog.
Your whole existence, all that you
have or will experience, I am sad to say, may not extend beyond the reading of
this post. Your memory, of course, is strongly to the contrary. It gives you
confidence that it was you who collected those New Year’s experiences. Our
theory has it, however, that your memory deceives you completely on this point.
It was a predecessor self who formed those memories in the brain that you
inherited.
So, the solution to the puzzle that
preceded this section, and I think the only solution, is that your self is
reading this post and a different self, a predecessor of yours, is doing the
celebrating, and neither self has any better claims than the other to existence
or nowness. This is the way to make your confidence that the now is here and
not at any New Year’s Eve, compatible with the theory that there is no
objective moving now.
Of course, for medical, or legal,
or social, or pretty much any of the reasons for which we usually ask the
question “Is that the same person,” you are indeed the same person as the New
Year’s celebrator. It is only in knowing the true state of affairs that it
would be self-interestedly irrational for the party-goer to fear having any
experience that will be yours today. It is only the real metaphysical you that
is limited to the here and now, and for most ordinary purposes this
metaphysically correct measure of personal identity is irrelevant. (For some
nuance on this, see Appendix.)
The theory I am outlining is, I
think, implicit in suggestive remarks by such eternal block proponents as
Einstein and Greene, whether or not they fully faced its implications. I call it the “mayfly theory” to
emphasize the tight temporal limits it places on personal identity. Your
existence registers on only a short segment of the time dimension of space-time.
Here, unfortunately, our language
of tenses and durations is less than adequate to its task. Each of our physical-metaphysical
selves occupies a small region of space-time, but we occupy our region “forever.”
It never goes out of existence. So, in one way your existence is short – on the
time dimension of space time; in another way your existence is eternal –
because your segment of space time exists always.
This is perhaps why Einstein, in his letter
to the family of his recently deceased friend, took the physics of time to be
consolatory, preceding his statement about the lack of separation among past,
present and future with this: “Now he has also taken leave of this peculiar
world a little before me. That is of no significance.” To what extent we really
ought to be consoled will get a little attention in the Appendix.
The Duration Problem
As I have outlined the mayfly theory,
a person exists in a physically and metaphysically basic way only for a
“moment” – a weasel word if ever there was one. I then, without any
justification, went on as if a moment might stretch across the reading of a
blog post. Why so long?
If the basic idea is right, isn’t
the you who started reading the post as different from you now as is your
New Year’s self? If you didn’t say,
“this is really now” when you first started reading, you could have. So, on the
theory we are working with, the blog-beginning-you cannot be the same as you.
This reasoning can be repeated,
driving the duration of your metaphysical existence shorter and shorter. Can it be stopped before we get down to the
Planck second? (Generally thought to be the “quantum” of time or shortest
meaningful time or shortest well-behaved time – 10-43 seconds.) Surely, that is
too short for a significant human existence. Some consolation it would be!
Maybe the intersection of brain functioning and metaphysics puts the mayfly
moment at the duration of the perceived or “specious” present, something near
the duration of a clock second. That is a lot longer than a Planck second, but
still makes for a pretty meager biography.
Perhaps there is a principled
argument for stretching the duration of the mayfly moment, but I haven’t found
one. I am equally at a loss for a way, without making use of mayfly personal
identity, to make consistent our experience of time with the
eternal-block-illusory-moving-now theory. That leaves three options: First, abandon
the theory of time we have been assuming (and risk a fight with the physicists);
Second, leave the duration problems as footnote objection to the block-mayfly theory,
hopefully to be successfully dealt with later; Third, bite the bullet by arguing
that the memories created by a chain of selves, however many and brief, could
create the illusion of a single self across time as well as the illusion of a moving
now. This latter seems the intellectually soundest option, although, on it, any
consolatory virtue of the theory has, I think, gone negative.
For a different take on the moving
now, sometimes called the “spotlight theory,” which takes it to be
non-illusory, although consistent with an eternal block see http://lawrencecrocker.blogspot.com/2017/07/two-or-more-moving-spotlights-of-time.html?m=0.
That post is not, admittedly, orthodox now-spotlight theory, as it takes up the
possibility of two different nows moving across the 4 dimensional block, and
asks whether the spotlight could sweep backwards.
It appears that is possible to draw
support for a view like that of Einstein and Greene from traditional theology.
See “Is the Moving Now an Illusion if God is Omniscient?” http://lawrencecrocker.blogspot.com/2014/06/is-moving-now-illusion-if-god-is.html.
Appendix of Some Further Issues
Ambiguities of “Eternity” and the Question of Consolation
As mentioned in passing above, our
old-fashioned vocabulary of time words is ill equipped to express the
eternal-block-no-moving-now theory of time. In particular, a human lifetime, is
not eternal old-talk (eternal-O) (not of infinite duration). On the theory,
however, every human experience exists as fully as any other event in
space-time. Your experience now is eternal new-talk (eternal-N). How much is eternal-N like eternal-O? Is it
enough alike to use the same word, or do we thereby court only confusion?
If your life, or a potion thereof, were
eternal-N, would that be something to celebrate? For these purposes, let us put the mayfly
theory aside and assume that your personal identity stretches all the way from
birth to death. Now you are told that
your tenth birthday party exists just as really as does your reading this
sentence and that both will exist for eternity-N.
One possible response:
Y: Well fine, but, as
I do not seem to be experiencing that birthday party, its eternal-N existence
doesn’t do anything for me.
I: Perhaps you are not experiencing it only
because you are under the spell of the illusion of a moving now.
Y But that illusion, if it is an illusion, is always-O
with me. It must somehow curtain me off from whatever advantages eternity-N has
to offer. I don’t suppose I am going to be suddenly freed from the illusions of
a moving now when I die, thereafter enjoying the benefits of eternity-N. That sounds like cheap fantasy fiction.
Or am I supposed,
postmortem, to experience my whole total life altogether and forever? What in
the world would that be like?
I: Well,
there is, of course, a time dimension within your eternal-N spatio-temporal
region. As the old saw has it, time is a way to keep everything from happening
at once.
Y: Then do I rerun my
life event by event forever (a la Nietzsche’s eternal recurrence) so that
inside eternity-N there is still the illusion of a moving now?
I: Well, maybe.
Having handled with such aplomb
your concerns about the claims of eternal existence of block-eternalism having temporarily
put aside the mayfly theory of personal identity, let me return
to the idea that the existence of the metaphysical self is, in fact, very
short. I contend we know what it is to have an eternal-N experience if this
extreme mayfly theory is right. It is exactly what you are experiencing at this
moment.
Y: How can you call that any kind of eternity -O
or -N?
I: Well,
it’s happening isn’t it? And do you have any good reason to think it hasn’t
always and will always be happening? If it were really only a passing instant,
what are the chances, against the universe’s billions of years, that this
instant, your instant, should be the special one?
Y: That is an
obviously fallacious use of probability. What, after all, are the chances of
being on just this planet out of a reference class of all the real estate of
the universe? And even if it were improbable that this instant is now, that is
just the fact. I know it hasn’t always been, because, just half an hour ago, I
was . . .
I: Ah,
but on the mayfly theory that half hour ago is a matter of prior-O events of
which your knowledge comes from memories passed to you by your predecessor
selves. That a moving now has gotten to this event and is departing is an
illusion. What is not an illusion is that you exist at this event and that it
is now and will exist and be now forever-N.
I think that these are the
responses that I should make to your criticism of the mayfly
version of the eternal-block-no-moving-now theory, but I am not at all sure
that they should satisfy you. More fundamentally, it is not clear to me, with
or without mayfly personal identity, that eternal-N really has anything
important in common with what we have always before thought of as eternal.
The Implications of Special Relativity
Yet more pressing is whether
Einstein’s relativity of simultaneity, the headwaters for all forms of the
eternal-block-illusory-moving-now theory, really implies that theory in its
mayfly form or any other.
Belief in Unbelievable Metaphysics
Even if the arguments were to convince you
that it must be so, it may be hard to believe that, e.g., a
predecessor self exists and celebrates New Year’s exactly as you exist and read
this.
Going back at least as far as Parmenides
and the fifth century BCE, there have been metaphysical theories that have been
sincerely contested for but in which no one, including their authors could
possibly have wholeheartedly believed. In the particular case of Parmenides, he
and his pupil Zeno argued, with force and sophistication, that the only thing
that really exists in a uniform, uncreated, unchanging, space-filling, sphere.
I am sure that Parmenides really
believed this. I am also sure that he didn’t. For the latter proposition I
would cite, as modest evidence, the second half of his sole surviving writing.
It apparently set out an account of the common sense world in some detail,
unfortunately mostly lost. Parmenides regarded this as a description of
unreality, of “mere appearance. Still, he did deal with it in a depth that suggests
he was covering his bets in case he might be wrong about that sphere. He
believed, I think, at the same time inconsistent things.
We all know people who would
sincerely say that they are convinced of some proposition but act sometimes, or
even all or almost all the time, as if they believed the opposite. The idea
that people cannot believe, really believe, contradictory things is empirically
bad psychology, a psychology we have inherited from religious soul theories as
rationalized by Descartes. Psychological evidence is overwhelming that the
human mind and human consciousness are not nearly as unitary or transparent as thought
to be by Cartesians (those who know they are Cartesians and those who have no
clue).
It might be that Parmenides, Plato, Leibniz, Hume, Kant were great
philosophers in part because they were so single minded as to be unmoved by the
bizarreness of their own philosophies when measured against what they
themselves had believed before having been captured by their own arguments. (At
least Hume, however, recognized that the power of habit prevented even him from
achieving a practical commitment to his own theories. He took himself to have
proved conclusively that it is irrational to think it more probable than not
that the sun will rise tomorrow. He admitted, however, that such irrational
beliefs as that in tomorrow’s sunrise did control his out-of-the-study life.)
Anti-intellectuals, a recently resurgent demographic,
and intellectuals who think of themselves as “realists” in the
non-philosophical sense of that word, take it to be a sufficient refutation of
a theory that it is “unbelievable.” The mayfly theory of the self surely qualifies.
There are at least two things to be
said in favor of unbelievable theories, however. The first is, as we all know,
that some unbelievable things have turned out to be true, from heliocentrism to
evolution to non-Euclidean space and, important for current purposes, to the
relativity of simultaneity. The arrogance of equating unbelievable with false is
one of the best documented of obstacles to intellectual progress.
The second positive of unbelievable
theories is that even when false they may be fecund. Elaborating them, arguing
for and against, developing variations, and alternatives may lead somewhere
important. It doesn’t always. Many unbelievable theories are just dead ends.
When, however, there are apparently strong arguments in favor of an
unbelievable theory, it is very often worth taking seriously.
Life Consequences of the Mayfly Theory
For this Appendix item, I would
like, again, to put aside the arguments that the mayfly time period might be
utra-short and suppose that a self lasts for a respectable period of time, although
still well shorter than a normal lifetime.
Would believing this affect one’s life?
If many people believed, would it have social consequences? First, I think we
have to tune these questions down a couple of octaves. As discussed immediately
above, no one is going to believe a mayfly theory, at least, no one is going to
believe it at all wholeheartedly. It is going to be a belief of a distinctly
intellectual, theoretical sort. This is not to say that it isn’t genuinely
held, however, and even intellectual-theoretical-academic beliefs can have
consequences beyond the learned discipline and out into ordinary day to day
life.
It is not inconceivable that one might
derive some consolation in the face of death from the mayfly theory or a
variant. It is also conceivable that one might respond by trying to pack more
of what makes life valuable into the present, not sacrificing so much for
future experiences that only one’s successors will enjoy.
An extravagant extrapolation: if a
lot of people became very convinced of the theory, then there could be too
little postponement of pleasures, too much postponement of hard work, and, as
the economists would put it, too little savings. That would not be good for the
species, which might explain why our hardwiring is so uncongenial to mayfly
sorts of personal identity theories.
The effects of a belief in the
theory, inevitably only partial, will be further moderated by the fact that
even to the extent that you disbelieve that you, yourself, will benefit from
your savings, you have a concern for your successor selves that you do not have
for random strangers. It is rational to want to ameliorate the sufferings of
the successor selves of your body – of your person in the way we identify your
person for almost all purposes. You will not feel their pains, but they are
closely connected to you. They will have many of your memories, your values,
your projects. Most of their friends and loved ones will be the successors of your
friends and loved ones.
For the relation of the thesis that there is no privileged now to the traditional theology that God knows everything about the future, see:https://lawrencecrocker.blogspot.com/2014/06/is-moving-now-illusion-if-god-is.html.
For imagined evidence that the moving now is real, but there might be more than one of them, one perhaps moving "backwards," see https://lawrencecrocker.blogspot.com/2017/07/two-or-more-moving-spotlights-of-time.html
For the relation of the thesis that there is no privileged now to the traditional theology that God knows everything about the future, see:https://lawrencecrocker.blogspot.com/2014/06/is-moving-now-illusion-if-god-is.html.
For imagined evidence that the moving now is real, but there might be more than one of them, one perhaps moving "backwards," see https://lawrencecrocker.blogspot.com/2017/07/two-or-more-moving-spotlights-of-time.html
"Even before Einstein, physics was never really supportive of our common-sense ideas about time."
ReplyDeleteIt's both ridiculous and true that common sense is not something that deserves much confidence. (One of the values or learning some formal mathematics is that it powerfully nudges one to develop multiple ways to check (and cross check) ones results and procedures. There are other ways to do this, but errors in school math have no serious consequences outside of one's self esteem and (perhaps) grade point average.
Everyday life limits the amount of checking and double checking one can engage in, but it also reinforces the idea that what seems obvious is probably much more complicated if not misleading...
"Science, with physics at its base, ..."
ReplyDeleteIt might be a perfectly acceptable trope to put physics at the base of all science with mathematics (perhaps) "underlying" physics. (This is almost a “common sense” idea based on most of the popular writing about science that I’ve come across.)
What's unfortunate about this trope is that it smacks of reductionism even though I'm sure this not what you intended to do at all.
Our "common sense"(?) or naive predisposition is to have some "BASE"... something solid to stand on. For some of us this is physics (imagined to be at the "base" of all science). For others (in the West, anyway) it is some version of GOD (usually the Abrahamic one). Other more entertaining ideas are that everything is based on "the void", "mathematics", or "information." If I were smart (or a smartass) I might argue that each of those is just built-in "STOP" function to cease the vertigo of infinite recursion. (But that might suggest I ascribe to the idea that our multiverses are a simulation put out by some kind of computer program which might be another version of the idea that "information" is at the "base" of existence/reality.)
I think this idea that there has to be a base - a stopping point - is a western notion, one not as deeply held in Eastern religions and philosophies, but that might only be my naive (common senseless) received opinion. (Common sense for the ordinary person in the East is probably pretty similar to that of the average schmuck in Ashtabula. And esoterics in Cambridge and Calcutta probably have a lot in common too. The differences are probably most pronounced in certain formalities of philosophy and religion that common sense people don’t take too seriously.)
To seriously argue physics is (or isn’t) at the base of all sciences is something beyond my education and bandwidth. I don’t think that any positive argument could be “based” on the idea that physics deals with elementary particles that (in some non reductive way) are at the base of all we see and know. (I’d want to argue that quantum physics has pretty much completely demolished the idea of “particles” although our limited cognitive functions refuse to completely let go of the idea of particles as Russian-doll-style billiard balls wearing wave-like princess costumes OR intermingling glimmering pulses of sparkly waves that sometimes resolve decoherently into eccentric particle zoos when we stare at them too rudely.)
When Chemistry was “unified” with Physics, it might have been mainly because physics had developed models of electromagnetism that explained chemical bonds. This “unification” may be much more like an awkward “stitching together” than any kind of “reduction.
If someone wanted to argue that physics was the basis of all other sciences, they might want to do that because physics deals with space and time? I suspect though that what modern (Quantum and Relativistic) physics has really done is kick open a hornets’ nest of amazing questions about the nature of space and time and of the abilities of our minds to extend to deal with these questions.
I won’t even get into how “mind” is related to particles, waves, space or time because mathematics and physics break my brain by suggesting that there may be more than the four dimension of space time my brain can handle. Mathematics may be an extension of our minds that can “handle” multiple dimensions including the “imaginary” and the “hyper real”, but the way it handles such things is probably only manipulative and superficial. But by dealing with extra dimensions, even in a limited (but sometimes productive) way, it raises all kinds of questions although the only one I can hold onto is “Why do these extra dimension have to be limited to or have anything much to do with space and time?”
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ReplyDelete"For us believing physicists, the distinction between past, present and future has only the meaning of an illusion, albeit a stubborn one" -- Google translation of Einstein
ReplyDeleteWouldn’t any worthwhile theory of *mind* have to TRY to encompass the various “meanings” or “natures” of “illusions”? And how would that be different from encompassing various notions (or natures) of “reality”?
Much (most? (All???) common sense is imbued in illusion, or at least seems to be if we “believe” in physics and mathematics. But to call those illusions “tenacious” is probably an understatement. People who claim to exalt “objective reality” sometimes seem to be putting their faith in…
1) empirically based statistics or computational models (open to revision as new data emerges that may even perhaps require new algorithms)
B) certain experts that they *trust* to interpret the above
Or
iii) some form of communicative understanding (perhaps based on more than linguistics and computations) that allows sentient beings to cooperate and coordinate
But human (animal) passions magnified by cultural complexities make all such constructs appear quite feeble sometimes.
Mostly agree. Any theory on which a lot of the way we understand reality in living our lives is illusionary needs to be supplemented by an analysis of the illusion and its consequences for theory of mind, action theory, ethics . ..
Delete"Lines" separating past from future is a metaphor that is disallowed. But a "block" of "eternity", a "projector", and "frames" are metaphors used to suggest some"thing" "else."
ReplyDeleteNone of our metaphors seem to work unless they inspire us to think beyond space and time as some kind of "container" (another form of "block"?)
And this is only for space and time without even getting into "mind." The idea of "mind" emerging from complex systems of matter and energy (in space and time) almost suggest a layer cake inside the block container of space and time (an intentionally absurd and unsupportable metaphor.) The more Eastern(?) idea of "mind" giving forth space, time, energy, and matter suggests the metaphor of an ocean with a wavy sparkly surface giving forth plumes of spray and foam (probably no more helpful than the birthday cake...?)
I don't follow some of this. There is a line between past and future in the respect that for every event there is a past and a future. (It has unique past and future light cones.)
DeleteJust trying to rephrase questions language is ill equipped to express:
DeleteLight cones exist within space and time. Does consciousness?
It seems like a stupid question, BUT...
Yes, we (our minds with their limited consciousness) have great difficulty imagining any"thing" outside space and time. But imagination, physics and Maths ALL offer glimpses that space and time are limited (even if, in some dimensions, they are infinite and expanding). That does not mean we can legitimately project our imaginingings into "eternity" (a good enough name for what exists outside the "container" of space and time.
Most of our thinking is entwined with language, but some "thinking" also occurs with images, sounds, emotions and "gestalts". Those kinds of "thinking" don't necessarily link together coherently the way thoughts supported by language "seem" to.
Language tangled thinking is often pressed to express a "point" (of view) - or at least a question or two. I can't really do either (which helps make this hard to follow) though I am closer to just trying to form questions than making any points. These are just pre-occupations of mine.
My biggest problem with the Mayfly "self" is in its "basis" which is the "block" of eternity.
ReplyDelete"Block" just seems wrong. Not because of its shape, but because it seems so totally and firmly bounded. This "boundedness" is objectionable to me for more than one reason, and perhaps the least of these reasons being that it conflicts with perceptions supported by empirical data that our universe is expanding.
That is not to say that I think space time is limitless. Somewhere else it has been suggested that there are many types of infinities. Some may sometimes overlap, include one one another, intersect, and maybe there are infinities that perhaps never even interact in any way that we could measure or imagine. In any event, if there is more than one type of infinity and one infinity may involve elements or dimensions that are not involved in another infinity, then infinities can be limited.
When I talk about limited infinities, I'm less concerned with space and time than I am with metaphors like a number line, or Cartesian grids of multiple number lines - including the number line of imaginary numbers which can intersect with the number line of real numbers to form complex numbers.
I can also think of another form of infinity: the kind generated by the recursions of a computer program. This is also a limited infinity. Computer programs can also interact with other computer programs as well as so many other types of inputs, but their limits cannot be envisioned as anything like a straight number line.
So space time could be expanding along with a number of other "structures", "substances", or "dimensions" that may interact or influence space time, but are not necessarily contained or included in space time.
This might suggest a different metaphor for "now" which puts us as conscious beings right at a certain limit that fluctuates or "waves" within a infinite and eternal (in the sense of "outside" of space and time) manifold. We could call this wavering, wiggling, squirming limit (or frontier) a chain of "nows". Being at different points on this dynamic, curvy, squiggle gives us different frames of reference with regards to time if we care to notice them. What this squiggly boundary is beside now is I don’t know, but if it exists must have something to do with something related to “consciousness” because that is what is experiencing it. (?)
If this is not totally ridiculous, it might obviate the need for any mayfly series of self reconstructions without suggesting anything about continuity of “Self” or “identity" over "time.”
Don't get too hung up on the work "block" or "eternal" for that matter. Everyone who holds the block eternalist theory thinks that the universe is expanding. Even blocks can expand. That there are (inintely) many infinities is well known to math. That there might be different sorts of physical phenomena best theorized in terms of different mathematical infinities is plausible. Your final metaphor, gives me a vague sense of a picture, but it is pretty vague.
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